212. Transforming Leadership: From Employee Experience to Brand Success with Mick Spiers

Ever wondered how the employee experience shapes a brand's reputation?

Dive into an enlightening conversation with Jason Antoine, where we explore the profound connection between a positive work environment and enhanced customer experiences. Leaders play a pivotal role in this dynamic, and by fostering empathy and genuine connections, they can transform not only the workplace but also their brand's image. We highlight the importance of recognizing toxic workplace behaviors and the transformative steps leaders can take to nurture a culture of growth and adaptability. Learn how creating a valued and engaged workforce is the key to elevating your organization’s success in the market.

Join us as we welcome Irene Riad, founder of Sightset and co-author of "Radical Becoming," who shares her expertise on Jungian psychology and the journey of self-identity. Her insights into Carl Jung’s concepts of the self, ego, and persona offer invaluable lessons on leadership and personal growth. While addressing the common resistance to change, we share strategies to turn this into resilience, equipping you with tools to cultivate a thriving work culture. 

This episode promises to enrich your understanding of leadership dynamics, supported by research from the American Psychological Association, and offers practical wisdom to transform your organizational environment.

Chapters

• 0:01 Impact of Employee Experience on Brand
• 13:24 Impact of Toxic Workplaces on Organizations
• 17:58 Exploring Jungian Psychology and Self-Identity

Transcript

Mick Spiers: 0:00

What is the correlation between employee experience and customer experience, and what impact does that have on your brand and on your profitability? And what about toxic workplaces? Have you ever thought as to whether your organization is toxic and what you as a leader can do about it in today's Episode of The Leadership Project, it will be a solo cast where I reflect on the amazing interview with Jason ANTH, one about employee experience, and I'll be sharing the latest results on surveys into workplace toxicity. Welcome back to The Leadership Project. I'm your host, Mick Spiers, and today we're doing another solo cast where I'll be sharing my reflections from the recent conversation with Jason Anthoine. Jason brought such a wealth of knowledge and experience to our discussion on employee experience, and I felt his insights deserved a closer look. I'll also be sharing some recent research from the American Psychological Association about the level of toxicity in the workplace and whether we have a full appreciation of what is going on there. So today we'll deep dive into the essence of what makes employee experience impactful, highlighting the pivotal role leaders play, the effect of employee experience on your brand, the concept of change and the importance of learning from failures. So let's get started. Let's look at the human side of employee experience. One of the core insights Jason shared, and something I find crucial for all of us to understand, is that employeeexperience isn't just shaped by processes or policies. It's built through interactions with human beings, especially leaders. No handbook or framework can replace the influence of a leader who genuinely connects with their team. Imagine this, if an employee comes into work each day and finds a leader who shows empathy, listens actively, and encourages open dialog. That's the foundation of a positive employee experience. But if that same employee encounters a leader who's disengaged or overly directive, it chips away at their enthusiasm and their sense of value over time, this has a compounded effect, as Jason and I discussed in the interview, when people go home, if they've had a bad day, they never talk about their topic. They never talk about a spreadsheet that didn't do what they wanted it to door something about the craft. It's nearly always about how someone else behaved in the workplace, how someone treated them and how someone made them feel as leaders, we should strive to be consistent in our interactions, creating an environment where people feel respected and supported, even small gestures like taking time to ask someone how their weekend went, or acknowledging their contributions in team meetings are simple but effective ways to build connection, and the research backs it up, employees are more likely to stay with the company where they feel They have a strong, positive relationship with their leaders. One of my favorites is just a handwritten note. It doesn't even have to cost a lot of money to show your appreciation for the efforts that someone else is putting in. One of the favorite concepts that Jason brought to the show was his phrase that brand is equal to experienced, squared, that your brand is your employee experience, times your customer experience, essentially the experience your employees have internally becomes the experience they pass on to your customers. In a compounding effect, if your employees are having a negative experience, they are less likely to deliver a great experience to your clients or customers, andthat, in turn, affects the brand. Think about the times you've interacted with a company and left feeling dissatisfied. Often it wasn't the product itself, but the interaction with an employee that left a mark. When employees feel undervalued or overworked, that frustration seeps into their customer interactions. On the otherhand, one. Employees are empowered and enjoy coming to work. They are naturally more enthusiastic, creating a positive feedback loop for customers. As leaders, we need to understand that taking care of our people isn't just a HR initiative, it's a brand strategy. Every positive interaction employees have internally, strengthens your brand's reputation. Externally, building abrand, therefore, starts with building an experience that resonates with your employees. I can share a story recently with one of my friends that really resonates with us. He bought a car from Range Rover, a very reputable brand, and the car did have some problems, but the fact that the company went out of their way, they did everything humanly possible to resolve the issue, to my friend's full satisfaction, he's now going to be acustomer of that company for life. And that all started with a product issue, something that might have ended up with a poor reputation, but they were able to turn it into a positive experience and something that will makemy friend a customer for the rest of his life. So what about the reluctance towards change? This is another point Jason made, which is both insightful and challenging. It's not that people dislike change, it's that they resist changing themselves. Change is uncomfortable, and even when we know it's for the best, there's an instinct to avoid it. For employees, the idea of change can feel like a disruption to routine, comfort and even their identity. This was very similar to our episode with Jake Jacobs, where he spoke about the fact that people don't it's not that people don't like change. They don't like to be changed, dear. And what Jason brought to it is it's not that they don't want to seechange, it's that they don't want to change themselves. They want to see the change in others. So as leaders, part of our role is to ease this process. We can't just announce a change and expect enthusiasm. We have to help people understand why change is happening and what's in it for them, let's consider the example of introducing a new technology in the workplace. For some employees, this might mean learning newskills, facing the fear of the unknown, or even worrying about their job security. When it comes to their identity, they might be considered the expert in the current technology, and they might be worried that they won't be the expert at the other end of this journey, so will their identity still be intact? This is where empathy and open communication becomes invaluable. Instead of presenting change as a mandate, we should present it as an opportunity for growth. By involving employees in the change process, listening to their concerns and offering the support they need, we can transform their resistance into resilience. Change becomes less daunting when employees feel equipped to handle it and when they know their leaders are with them every step of the way. So we change with our people and through our people, we don't force change upon our people. Lastly, I want to touch on a topic that doesn't get nearly enough attention, and that was failure. Jason pointed out that we often overlook failure as a crucial part of learning in an organization, in our quest for success, we sometimes forget that failure is an inevitable part of the journey and a powerful teacher. In fact, some of the most successful leaders and innovators have countless failures behind their achievements. Take the example of a product launch that didn't meet expectations. Instead of sweeping it under the rug, what if we brought the team together to analyze what went wrong, almost celebrating the failure and turning it into that learning. This isn't about assigning blame, but about collectively learning from the experience, so wecan do better next time, reflecting on failures, both individually and as a team, can be incredibly liberating. And as leaders, we need to role model this behavior from the outset. It In short, it shows employees that mistakes are not the end, but rather a stepping stone. When leaders are transparent about their own setbacks and what they learnt from that, it creates a culture where failure is. Stigmatized, but seen as a path to growth. So where does this leave us? Reflecting on Jason's insights, I believe that creating an impactful employee experience requires intentional leadership. It means understanding that each interaction is an opportunity to build trust that employees are the face of your brand, that change needs to be a collaborative journey, and that failures are lessons in disguise. If there's one takeaway, I hope you'll remember, it's this, leading is about more than setting goals or driving performance. It'sabout connecting with your people in a way that makes them feel valued, trusted and inspired. Everyone wants to feel heard, they want to feel seen, and they want to feel valued. They want to feel like they matter, and mattering starts with having a clear purpose and being recognized and acknowledged for the work that you do. When we do that, we create a workplace where people want to come they want to come to work. They don't have to come to work. They want to come to work. And we create a brand that customers want to support and a legacy that we can be proud of. Now. At the other end of the scale of an exceptional employee experience is what we call a toxic workplace. There was a recent survey conducted by the American Psychological Association that brought to light some pretty damning statistics about the level of toxicity in the workplace. It found 15% of respondents labeled their workplace as very toxic. It also found that 59% of respondents thought that their employers, or their bosses, their leaders think that their workplace environment is mentally healthier than it actually is. This one didn't surprise me too much. What this is telling us is that leaders don't always have full awareness of the level of mental stress that is happening in the workplace, and we need to raise that awareness. The one that shocked me more was we still are in an age where 39% of respondents felt that if they spoke up about a mental health condition, that it would negatively impact their career, the stigma of mental health still exists. This is deeply concerning for me, and as we're about to go into Movember in Australia, which is a month where we talk aboutmen's health, including mental health and the rate of suicide, I am deeply worried that this stigma still exists where people don't feel that they can speak up and talk about any mental health condition for fear that it might have negative consequences in the workplace. So this research really highlights the silent toll that toxic environments take on both employees and the business itself. Toxic workplaces don't just impact morale. They actively reduce productivity. They drive talent away and they affect the health of all the workers. Things like disrespect, exclusion, unethical practices and cutthroat competition are common markers, and the economic impact is staggering, with disengaged employees costing organizations billions each year. So not only is it not good for the people, and no one deserves to work in a workplace like that, it's also costing the organization. People spend up to 1/3 of their life in the workplace, and this is why it's on leaders. It's our responsibility to be the custodian of that workplace andto make sure that it isn't toxic. A critical point to remember is that leadership plays that pivotal role in setting the positive tone and removing that toxicity. Leaders who foster inclusivity, accountability and respect can transform even challenging environments into spaces where people want to come to work. As leaders, we have an obligation not just to improve individual experiences, the employee experience, but to protect the organization's well being, and that means that we need to set the right culture and to put a squash right down on any level of toxicity. So let's unpack the study alittle more. What are the warning signs? What are the warning signs to look out for to see whether your workplace is toxic? The first one is a lack of open communication and diverse perspectives, where people are not feeling that they can speak up, where you see behaviors that are more like self preservation amongst both leaders and employees, where there's not a lot of growth opportunity in the organization, where people don't see where they might go, we might have a lot of transactional leadership rather than collaborative relationships, where it's a big trade off of, you know, driving people to work harder for some kind of temporary reward where there's a lack of transparency during an interview, if, if you're interviewing in an organization andyou're wondering whether it is toxic, you need to ask questions about what it's like. What do you like about this organization? What don't you like about these organization it's completely fine to ask these kind of questions in a new year. Now, if you are having some of these toxic traits, what can a leader do? Well, you need to dive deep into continuous self reflection. You need to think about the role that you're playing in shaping the workplace environment and what you can do to get a different result. You need to prioritize open communication and foster a culture where people will come to you and tell you what's really going on. You need to give people opportunities for growth and development. You need to lead with transparency and respect role model or behavior that you're looking to see in others address any power dynamics. If you see any kind of situation where people misusing power, you need to nip that in the bud very quickly and create a culture of psychological safety, where people do feel that the benefits of speaking up a outweigh any fear of doing so. So it's clear from this week, from the great interview with Jason Antwan and thisnew research from the American Psychological Association, that employee experience has an incredible multiplier on your organization. Firstly, it's the right thing to do. People deserve to work in a place where they feel seen, heard and valued, where they feel respected. People don't deserve to work in a place that's toxic, and the toxicity has the exact opposite effect of an incredible employee experience. These employees are the ambassadors of your brand, and if they are having a bad experience, that is going to soon be translated into a bad experience for your customers. So that's it for today. In the next episode, I'll be joined by the amazing IreneRiad, the founder of an organization called sightset and the co author of a book with Brian Tracy called Radical becoming. Irene completely opened my eyes to the work of Carl Jung and the thoughts around the self, the ego, the persona, your identity. There were so many things that came out of this episode. It's one of my favorite interviews so far on the leadership project, so please don't miss it in the next episode, if you've been getting great value from our work, we would love it if you would leave a rating and review on Apple podcast or your preferred podcast service. You can also subscribe to The Leadership Project YouTube channel, where we bring you weekly video podcasts, curated videos, and also our live stream show. Thank you for listening to The Leadership Project mickspiers.com a huge call out to Faris Sedek for his video editing of all of our video content and to all of the team at TLP. Joan Gozon, Gerald Calibo and my amazing wife Sei Spiers I could not do this show without you. Don't forget to subscribe to The Leadership Project YouTube channel, where we bring you interesting videos each and every week, and you can follow us on social,particularly on LinkedIn, Facebook and Instagram. Now, in the meantime, please do take care. Look out for each other and join us on this journey as we learn together and lead together.